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Wires are magnetized when I start the drive and displays on the PMU "0000"

Created by: arthr at: 7/5/2013 10:54 PM (37 Replies)

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7/5/2013 10:54 PM	Rate (0)
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)	I have a problem with a drive model 6SE7035 - 1EK60 wires are magnetized when I start the drive and displays on the PMU "0000", I check the current in the motor and the drive monitor show 450 Amp, I swap all the components and the same problem occurs. when I start the drive motor turns slowly and wires magnetize and repel each other and displays on the PMU "0000", I send you the DNL file with all the parameter used to run the motor andwhich causes this error. I'm controlling a motor of 300 HP with this drive. somebody who can help me for this error. Regardings.
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)
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7/5/2013 11:02 PM	Rate (0)
IBN-Service Posts: 8946 Rating: (1000)	Is the drive enabled?
IBN-Service Posts: 8946 Rating: (1000)
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7/5/2013 11:07 PM	Rate (0)
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)	i check all the signs and all are well. the problems is when i send the signal to move the motor, the current increase at 450 A y the wire begin to repel each other. i think is some parameter.
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)	Last edited by: arthr at: 7/5/2013 11:10 PM
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7/6/2013 2:31 AM	Rate (0)
Vithani Platinum Expert Joined: 7/8/2009 Last visit: 6/7/2025 Posts: 1977 Rating: (479)	Problem is your drive is getting start command but Not reference Please check all setpoint related parameter You can check actual setpoint in Parameter r0014 If you are not getting anything in r0014, you have to check setpoint Parameter for setpoint is P443 so check value in P443 and back trace from it If setpoint is from Profibus, check value from PLC side too For checking, try running drive from PMU it self. For this, set P443 to 58 and start the drive then increase or decrease speed with PMU up and down arrow key Please check all these and revert with results Also tell us – what is the control mode you are using (P100-??) Regards, Devesh Vithani
	Last edited by: Vithani at: 7/6/2013 3:13 AM Last edited by: Vithani at: 7/6/2013 3:11 AM I dont Like people driving Fast, thats the reason I overtake them ;)
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7/6/2013 6:14 AM	Rate (0)
IBN-Service Posts: 8946 Rating: (1000)	arthr ... the wire begin to repel each other.... i think is some parameter. ... Seems to be a poor cable installation also.
IBN-Service Posts: 8946 Rating: (1000)
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7/6/2013 7:10 AM	Rate (0)
N. Vijay Silver Member Joined: 3/17/2013 Last visit: 4/28/2025 Posts: 481 Rating: (43)	Dear Arthr, After start command, it is quite natural that motor takes magnetization current (in your case 450A), and as Vithani said, drive might not be receiving any speed setpoint. If it is commissioning job, always best to run the motor uncoupled and from PMU. Regards, Vijay

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7/6/2013 7:51 AM	Rate (0)
Vithani Platinum Expert Joined: 7/8/2009 Last visit: 6/7/2025 Posts: 1977 Rating: (479)	N. Vijay Dear Arthr, After start command, it is quite natural that motor takes magnetization current (in your case 450A), and as Vithani said, drive might not be receiving any speed setpoint. If it is commissioning job, always best to run the motor uncoupled and from PMU. Regards, Vijay As I said...
	I dont Like people driving Fast, thats the reason I overtake them ;)
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7/6/2013 5:13 PM	Rate (0)
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)	These two drives are mounted on a crane buckets, Opening or closing them or up and down the buckets., the drive's close is the master and the slave hold. this problem started when braking resistors damage. The hold`drive is in closed loop with P100 = 4, but to rule out the encoder open loop pass it with P100 = 3 ,and the problem persists. Attachment SAM_0192.JPG (642 Downloads)
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)
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7/6/2013 5:15 PM	Rate (0)
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)	this is the bucked crane. and the picture i send are the manetized wire when i start the drive. Attachment SAM_0204.JPG (610 Downloads)
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)
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7/6/2013 5:16 PM	Rate (0)
Vithani Platinum Expert Joined: 7/8/2009 Last visit: 6/7/2025 Posts: 1977 Rating: (479)	Have you checked Setpoint parameter as i asked? r014? p443?
	I dont Like people driving Fast, thats the reason I overtake them ;)
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7/6/2013 5:21 PM
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)	Dear Vithani in this weekend i can`t do any test , because im not in the refinery, i will do all the test you mention the nex monday. thanks for the recommendations, i will keep you informed ,
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)
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7/6/2013 5:25 PM
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)	dear Vithani this weekend i can`t do any test, because im not in the refinery. but the next monday i`ll do all the test you mention.
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)
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7/6/2013 5:31 PM	Rate (0)
IBN-Service Posts: 8946 Rating: (1000)	arthr dear Vithani this weekend i can`t do any test, because im not in the refinery. but the next monday i`ll do all the test you mention. Also we like to see some more pictures, if possible!
IBN-Service Posts: 8946 Rating: (1000)
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This contribution was helpful to 1 thankful Users Vithani

7/6/2013 5:35 PM	Rate (0)
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)	to Vithani Dear Vithani in thos moment i can`t do any test because im not in the refiney, but the next monday i will do all the test you mention and i keep you informed i apreciate your reply and i will continue reporting in the forum. regarding. Attachment SAM_0214.JPG (428 Downloads)
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)
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This contribution was helpful to 1 thankful Users Vithani

7/6/2013 5:46 PM	Rate (0)
Vithani Platinum Expert Joined: 7/8/2009 Last visit: 6/7/2025 Posts: 1977 Rating: (479)	arthr to Vithani Dear Vithani in thos moment i can`t do any test because im not in the refiney, but the next monday i will do all the test you mention and i keep you informed i apreciate your reply and i will continue reporting in the forum. regarding. Ok but check r014 after giving start command and just share us the readings you get - you will find us here on monday also
	I dont Like people driving Fast, thats the reason I overtake them ;)
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7/6/2013 7:18 PM	Rate (0)
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)	ok IBN service i can send you more pictures, just tell me what kind of picture you need to help me to solve this problem.. Regards ... Attachment 20130626_120207.jpg (482 Downloads)
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)
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7/7/2013 3:52 AM	Rate (0)
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)	dear Vithani I remember that i wanted to solve the problem performing the drive with autotuning, can you guide me how to make the autoning , i tried to perfroming the autotuning but i can realize it, because even though I put the key P358.1 = 414 y P358.2=262 y and the lock P359.1=414 y P359.2=262 did not allow me do it. On the Drive Monitor appear a windows that say I have not sufficient privileges to perform it. Than anything else I need to do the auto tuning? Question? when I add some new component to the system inverter-motor ,does i have to make auto tuning, ? Can this cause the behavior of magnetized wire? Regards Vithani
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)	Last edited by: arthr at: 7/7/2013 3:56 AM
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7/7/2013 4:09 AM	Rate (0)
Vithani Platinum Expert Joined: 7/8/2009 Last visit: 6/7/2025 Posts: 1977 Rating: (479)	arthr dear Vithani I remember that i wanted to solve the problem performing the drive with autotuning, can you guide me how to make the autoning , i tried to perfroming the autotuning but i can realize it, because even though I put the key P358.1 = 414 y P358.2=262 y and the lock P359.1=414 y P359.2=262 did not allow me do it. On the Drive Monitor appear a windows that say I have not sufficient privileges to perform it. Than anything else I need to do the auto tuning? Question? when I add some new component to the system inverter-motor ,does i have to make auto tuning, ? Can this cause the behavior of magnetized wire? Regards Vithani Well, I suggest you to go step by step. Before checking other possibilities, you should check the one which most suspicious Anyways, have you changed P60 after puting key in P358? First change P60 to 7 - and check whether you got full access or not And for autotunning, you need to change P60 to 5 and thenonly you can changeP115 to 4 and 5 If you have changed drive component- you dont need to perform autotunning, if you have changed something in field, autotunning is required But i am not sure this can help you much because autotunning is for fine response from drive but in your case motor is not even getting started for rotating Moreover if you are not getting any fault after starting, i am mostly sure that drive is not getting speed setpoint Regards, Devesh Vithani
	I dont Like people driving Fast, thats the reason I overtake them ;)
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7/7/2013 4:47 AM	Rate (0)
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)	To: Vithani OK i will go step by step. Im not change any component in the drive, i just changed one DBU(Dynamic Brake Unit) this unit was burnedin a short circuit occurred in the resistance, therefore i remplaced the DBU and the resitor. well i´ll do it all the test you suggest to me thanks you Regards Vithani.
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)	Last edited by: arthr at: 7/7/2013 4:48 AM
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7/8/2013 7:22 PM	Rate (0)
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)	Dear: Vithani I have in parameter P443.1 a reading 507 i changed the parameter P443 to 58 and i start the drive and nothing happened. You suggested that when i do this, i could control the drive with PMU up and down arrow key, but nothing happened. what else i need to set in the parameters to might control the drive with PMU? I already checked the speed reference in the control terminal strip X-102 (terminals 15+ , 16 -) and give me 0~10 VCC, all this in the CUVC. With this I´m sure that reference´s signal is Ok.. What other test can you suggest to do, and might solve the problem. if you need some pictures or files about the programation of drive i can send you.
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)
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7/8/2013 7:44 PM	Rate (0)
Vithani Platinum Expert Joined: 7/8/2009 Last visit: 6/7/2025 Posts: 1977 Rating: (479)	can you upload your program please? And have you checked r014 before changing setpoint to PMU? arthr I have in parameter P443.1 a reading 507 i changed the parameter P443 to 58 and i start the drive and nothing happened. what else i need to set in the parameters to might control the drive with PMU? I already checked the speed reference in the control terminal strip X-102 (terminals 15+ , 16 -) and give me 0~10 VCC, all this in the CUVC. With this I´m sure that reference´s signal is Ok.. Why you checking speed reference at X102? Your main setpoint P443 is set to 507 - which is coming from Limiter - that is from internal logic using free blocks And if you are sure, your reference is from Analog, then there are possible chances that this analog signal is used for further in logic In case you are using analog, you can give analog signal to terminals and read value in r637.1 - if you are not getting value, there may be wiring problem - have you changed CUVC ?? I am asking because you need to set analog switch - S3-in CUVC as per your AI configurations Now for PMU, what was the display when you changed P443 to 58? was it 008 or 009? I hope you are not using Dataset change over - for confirm also check value in P590 In any case, you need to upload program to make clear these many doubts Regards, Devesh Vithani Attachment AI selection switch.JPG (438 Downloads)
	Last edited by: Vithani at: 7/8/2013 9:01 PM attachment added Last edited by: Vithani at: 7/8/2013 8:51 PM I dont Like people driving Fast, thats the reason I overtake them ;)
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7/8/2013 8:47 PM	Rate (0)
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)	Ok i send the program it calls " wire magnetized" and already check the parameter r014 and it show the speed reference.. if you need more information here i am above the crane testing. waiting your responses. Regards Vithani. Attachment hold cables magnetizados.zip (433 Downloads)
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)
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7/8/2013 8:54 PM	Rate (0)
Vithani Platinum Expert Joined: 7/8/2009 Last visit: 6/7/2025 Posts: 1977 Rating: (479)	Ok let me check - Can you send PDF? I am having some trouble in Drive monitor installation And mean while please read my reply - I edited and replied in more detail but by that time you already replied Regards, Devesh Vithani
	Last edited by: Vithani at: 7/8/2013 9:31 PM Last edited by: Vithani at: 7/8/2013 9:02 PM I dont Like people driving Fast, thats the reason I overtake them ;)
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7/8/2013 10:10 PM	Rate (0)
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)	This drive was working correctly since one year ago, until one dinamic resitance was burned out as the same time was burnet out the DBU (Dinamic Brake Unit), all this component was remplaced and then the drive working again during a one month and it stopped during a 15 days, and then the crane operator wants to operate again and the drive began to do that behaviour. I tell you that the programam download in the CUVC dont suffer any change, but we have a two drives, and just one was fail, the close drive are ok but the hold drive is bad one ( the wire magnetized and the current increase at 450 ~ 700 Amp), can you tell why?? We did the next test: 1.- We swapped the CUVC from the drive good to the bad one and the problem remains. 2.- We swapped the IVI (Inverter - Value Interface), the IGD ( IGBT gate Driver), the PSU (Power Suply Unit), the six IGBT, and the problem remains. 3.- Abreviating we swapped all the component even the motor. The hold motor is ok, because we did isolation test. other doubt i have is that in the good close drive, we tested the hold motor and the same behaviour occurs ( wire magnetized), but the close drive with it own motor work well. why?
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)
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7/8/2013 10:13 PM	Rate (0)
IBN-Service Posts: 8946 Rating: (1000)	arthr ... other doubt i have is that in the good close drive, we tested the hold motor and the same behaviour occurs ( wire magnetized), but the close drive with it own motor work well. why? The cables are OK?
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7/8/2013 10:23 PM	Rate (0)
Vithani Platinum Expert Joined: 7/8/2009 Last visit: 6/7/2025 Posts: 1977 Rating: (479)	What about brakes? Have you checked it? Is it opening as soon asyou give command? How you are controlling brake? From your Backup, none of the DO is assigned to open the brakes
	I dont Like people driving Fast, thats the reason I overtake them ;)
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7/8/2013 10:55 PM	Rate (0)
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)	TO: Vithani The brake open normally as soon as i start the drive. yes i will sent you the Program in PDF. any question do you have here i am. Regards. Attachment Parametros hold drive wire magnetized.zip (440 Downloads)
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)	Last edited by: arthr at: 7/8/2013 11:40 PM
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7/8/2013 11:10 PM	Rate (0)
Vithani Platinum Expert Joined: 7/8/2009 Last visit: 6/7/2025 Posts: 1977 Rating: (479)	How brakes are controlled? Is it wired with any DO?? No need for PDF now as I installed Drive Monitor Just not able tofind any specific in your backup except brake controls Have you checked r014 at time of starting? And status of drive when you change P443 to 58?
	I dont Like people driving Fast, thats the reason I overtake them ;)
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7/8/2013 11:58 PM	Rate (0)
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)	To: Vithani i already check the PMU when i set the drive with the parameter P443 to 58 and the PMU show 009, when i star the drive in the r014 display only ¨0000¨ and the motor turn slowly, i returd the parameter P443 to 507 , and i star the drive , the r014 display ¨44¨ with 1 volts in the analog speed referece in the control terminal strip X-102, and the same beaviour occurs. im waiting your answer. Regards Vithani.. i sent you the Program in PDF, the control brake is with PLC, this PLC Attachment Parametros hold drive wire magnetized.zip (442 Downloads)
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)
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7/9/2013 6:49 AM	Rate (0)
Vithani Platinum Expert Joined: 7/8/2009 Last visit: 6/7/2025 Posts: 1977 Rating: (479)	arthr i already check the PMU when i set the drive with the parameter P443 to 58 and the PMU show 009, when i star the drive in the r014 display only ¨0000¨ and the motor turn slowly, Yes initially it will be 0000, have you tried to increase setpoint from Up button from PMU? arthr i returd the parameter P443 to 507 , and i star the drive , the r014 display ¨44¨ with 1 volts in the analog speed referece in the control terminal strip X-102, and the same beaviour occurs. I back traced your logic and found that In this case, both of your Analog inputs are being used You should check at Parameter r637 in both index - index 1 for AI 1 and index 2 for AI2 You said you are getting 1 V only - is it normal? Also do one thing - set P032 to 507 and check value in r033 when you give start command - this will show your speed setpoint in % value Also have a look at values r003,4,5,7,14 and 15 Ok so here is what you have to do now - 1) change p443 to 58 and start drive then increase speed using Up button of PMU and share results 2) After that, again make P443 to 507 - P32 - 507,start drive, and check values of r637, r33, r3,r4,r5,r7,r14,r15 Regards, Devesh Vithani
	I dont Like people driving Fast, thats the reason I overtake them ;)
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7/9/2013 10:47 PM	Rate (0)
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)	dear vithani i have bad news!!! i changed the P443 to 58 and P032 to 507 the problem with the wires were solved. they dont magnetized anymore. But the current is still high (448 amperes) at any speed. speed (Hz): current: (amperes): 0 0 30 448 60 448 the chart showed before are the measurements What other test can I do to make the motor current works at its good value? Notice that the motor plate indicates these values MOTOR UNCOUPLED AND MAX SPEED 120 amperes MOTOR WITH LOAD AND MAX SPEED 280 amperes what all these indicates to me? regards and thanks.
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)
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7/10/2013 1:20 AM	Rate (0)
Vithani Platinum Expert Joined: 7/8/2009 Last visit: 6/7/2025 Posts: 1977 Rating: (479)	So now finally your motor is running Is it decoupled and taking this much current? You can perform Autotunning first. Also have you changed mode to Close loop? because backup you sent me shows you have changed P100 to 3 Change it back to 4 and try to run with encoder. Then perform Auto tunning in P115 Take trial, if everything seems OK, please check from motor side too. May be something bad from motor?? Brakes are not proper opening? Bearings? I hope you know procedure of Autotunning. It is shown in Manual in Chapeter 6.3.3 Drive setting Regards, Devesh Vithani
	I dont Like people driving Fast, thats the reason I overtake them ;)
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7/14/2013 12:07 AM	Rate (0)
Vithani Platinum Expert Joined: 7/8/2009 Last visit: 6/7/2025 Posts: 1977 Rating: (479)	Dear arthr Any update in this issue?
	I dont Like people driving Fast, thats the reason I overtake them ;)
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7/26/2013 8:43 PM	Rate (0)
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)	Dear Vithani here i am again, i was absent by two weeks because i had personal problems. so then, here i am again, i will continue solving the problem which is still present . Can you continue help us? we are in touch .....¡¡¡¡
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)
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7/27/2013 4:17 AM	Rate (0)
Vithani Platinum Expert Joined: 7/8/2009 Last visit: 6/7/2025 Posts: 1977 Rating: (479)	arthr Dear Vithani here i am again, i was absent by two weeks because i had personal problems. so then, here i am again, i will continue solving the problem which is still present . Can you continue help us? we are in touch .....¡¡¡¡ have you checked as i said??
	I dont Like people driving Fast, thats the reason I overtake them ;)
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7/31/2013 8:42 PM	Rate (0)
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)	Dear Vithani Thanks for your help and support i mention that i found the fault, as you said me the problem was the reference, the encoder board was giving incorret voltaje and the observation parameter read nothing. so i changed the encoder board and the problem was solve. so can you send me information about this drive to preparing myself if somethin fail .. i mention you that the crane are operating again i have another question, what another parameter i need to change to the drive restored itself when a faul occurs. thanks for your attention attm: Luis Arturo
arthr Posts: 23 Rating: (0)
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8/1/2013 6:26 AM	Rate (0)
Vithani Platinum Expert Joined: 7/8/2009 Last visit: 6/7/2025 Posts: 1977 Rating: (479)	arthr so can you send me information about this drive to preparing myself if somethin fail .. Read Manual and this forum for information about different faults and their solution, that will make you feel confident incase of same problem comes to you arthr what another parameter i need to change to the drive restored itself when a faul occurs. Check P373 for auto restart. BUT It is NOT RECOMMENDED to set auto restart for fault. You must go and check the fault and its cause before making it reset Regards, Devesh Vithani
	I dont Like people driving Fast, thats the reason I overtake them ;)
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11/20/2017 1:59 PM	Rate (0)
Jen_Moderator Diamond Member Joined: 6/19/2017 Last visit: 9/6/2024 Posts: 8171 Rating: (174)	New question published by ekalavya_secret-learner is split to a separate thread with the subject How Master drive and Sinamics drive can share common DBU?. Best regards Jen_Moderator

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