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Selection of an equivalent motor.

Created by: PISCEAN 2010 at: 6/15/2012 9:08 AM (12 Replies)

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6/15/2012 9:08 AM	Rate (0)
PISCEAN 2010 Diamond Expert Joined: 4/23/2010 Last visit: 12/31/2023 Posts: 8092 Rating: (878)	Hello Experts, On one of heavy duty lathe, for rotation application of main chuck, following specified DC motor is used. General Electric Direct current Motor Sr. No 7177900, HP 250, RPM 300/1500, Type OD-1761Y, Amp-875, Volts- 230, Exc. Volt – 230, Wound SHUNT, COMM – 55C, INS WDG – 40 We would like to replace this motor by an equivalent but AC motor. Can any one suggest me which series & rating Siemens make motor, to be selected? Thanks in advance. DEEP.

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6/15/2012 10:33 AM	Rate (0)
Technology Team Platinum Expert Joined: 10/11/2006 Last visit: 11/8/2024 Posts: 5935 Rating: (815)	Hello, in this power range the 1PH8 would fit. The motor exists as synchronous and asynchronous version, forced ventilation and water cooling. Please follow the link: https://intranet.automation.siemens.com/mcms/mc/en/motors/motion-control-motors/simotics-m-main-motors/simotics-m-1ph8/Pages/simotics-m-1ph8.aspx Configuration manual: https://support.automation.siemens.com/WW/llisapi.dll?func=cslib.csinfo&lang=de&objid=46484744&caller=nl Unfortunately the latest version 5/2012 is currently only in German available. The EN version 4/2010 includes not the current portfolio. The latest version in EN will be to download in about 4...6 weeks. You could use the tool SIZER to select in easy way a possible motor: https://support.automation.siemens.com/WW/llisapi.dll?func=cslib.csinfo&nodeid0=28311063&lang=en&siteid=csius&aktprim=0&extranet=standard&viewreg=WW&subtype=130000&nav0=index&objid=10804987&idx0=&idxSrc0=sizer CAD-files via www.cad-creator.com HP 250 means 184KW For example 1PH8284-1xC4 with 171KW @ 700rpm. The motor existswith different rated points (windings).Bigger motors available as well. Attached the characterisitc curve of the motor above. Attachment 1PH8284-1.C4.pdf (500 Downloads)
	With best regards, Technology Team Application consulting and pre sales support for SINAMICS, SIMATIC Technology, SIMOTION, SIMOTICS and MOTION CONNECT
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6/17/2012 5:55 AM	Rate (0)
PISCEAN 2010 Diamond Expert Joined: 4/23/2010 Last visit: 12/31/2023 Posts: 8092 Rating: (878)	Hello TechTeam, Thank you very much for your reply. As mentioned in my earlier post, this is heavy duty lathe. Maximum job loading capacity is of 40T. This main DC motor is used to rotate & brake such huge mass. (DC drive is of 4Q)To the best of my knowledge, the starting torque of DC shunt motor is very high & running torque is constant from low speed to its base speed range. With this 1PH8 series motor, is it possible to havesame motor characteristics as that of DC motor i.e. achieve high starting as well as constant, torque during normal rotational speed? Thanks & regards, DEEP.
	Last edited by: PISCEAN 2010 at: 6/17/2012 6:29 AM
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6/17/2012 7:03 AM	Rate (0)
PISCEAN 2010 Diamond Expert Joined: 4/23/2010 Last visit: 12/31/2023 Posts: 8092 Rating: (878)	TechTeam Hello, in this power range the 1PH8 would fit. The motor exists as synchronous and asynchronous version, forced ventilation and water cooling. Please follow the link: https://intranet.automation.siemens.com/mcms/mc/en/motors/motion-control-motors/simotics-m-main-motors/simotics-m-1ph8/Pages/simotics-m-1ph8.aspx Attached the characterisitc curve of the motor above. Hello, When trying to open above link, getting error meassage. Please find attached here with the screen shot of error message. Is there another way to visit or see above link information? Thanks, DEEP. Attachment Error message.JPG (517 Downloads)

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6/19/2012 2:29 PM	Rate (0)
Technology Team Platinum Expert Joined: 10/11/2006 Last visit: 11/8/2024 Posts: 5935 Rating: (815)	Hello, sorry, the link is only for internal use. Please try this one: https://www.automation.siemens.com/mcms/mc/de/motoren/motion-control-motor/hauptmotor-simotics-m/simotics-m-1ph8/Seiten/simotics-m-1ph8.aspx You can see the motor characteristic attached. Constant torque from start up torated torque. Attachment 1PH8284-1.C4.pdf (449 Downloads)
	With best regards, Technology Team Application consulting and pre sales support for SINAMICS, SIMATIC Technology, SIMOTION, SIMOTICS and MOTION CONNECT
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6/28/2012 7:41 AM	Rate (0)
PISCEAN 2010 Diamond Expert Joined: 4/23/2010 Last visit: 12/31/2023 Posts: 8092 Rating: (878)	Hello, Thank you very much for your reply.While selection of motor which parameter should be more weighted, means power or Torque? According to me, both should meet. As per the original DC motor, its rated torque works out to be 5936.29 Nm. So I select a motor near by this rating as follows. 1PH8352, 370 Kw, Mrated = 7361 Nm. with spees range N2 max = 800, N max 2800 RPM.Is this correct? Regards, DEEP.

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7/3/2012 1:19 PM	Rate (0)
Technology Team Platinum Expert Joined: 10/11/2006 Last visit: 11/8/2024 Posts: 5935 Rating: (815)	Hello, it's equal because power = torque x omega (omega = 2 x pi x n) So if youconsider power of the DC motor pleaseconsider power of the 1PH8 as well. Example: 184KW @ 300upm M = 184KW / (2xpix300upm/60s) => M=5857Nm => the question is in which speed range you need this torque. The easiest way is to compare themotor characteristic curves.
	With best regards, Technology Team Application consulting and pre sales support for SINAMICS, SIMATIC Technology, SIMOTION, SIMOTICS and MOTION CONNECT
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7/4/2012 1:47 PM	Rate (0)
PISCEAN 2010 Diamond Expert Joined: 4/23/2010 Last visit: 12/31/2023 Posts: 8092 Rating: (878)	Hello, What you say is true. Kindly note in my case, present DC motor torque is 5936 Nm upto 300 RPM. The 1PH8284-, 184 Kw motor rated torque as per chart is 2333 Nm upto 700 RPM which is 60% less than the required torque. Hence I think this won't be anequivalent motor.Please see the attached sheet. Do you agree this point? Regards, DEEP. Attachment 1PH8284-1.C4[1].pdf (482 Downloads)

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7/6/2012 10:37 AM	Rate (0)
Technology Team Platinum Expert Joined: 10/11/2006 Last visit: 11/8/2024 Posts: 5935 Rating: (815)	Hello, yes, I definitly agree with you ! The 1PH8284-1.C would not fit for your requirement. It was only an example. If you really have 184KW @ 300rpm => you need a bigger 1PH8.
	With best regards, Technology Team Application consulting and pre sales support for SINAMICS, SIMATIC Technology, SIMOTION, SIMOTICS and MOTION CONNECT
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7/6/2012 11:00 AM	Rate (0)
PISCEAN 2010 Diamond Expert Joined: 4/23/2010 Last visit: 12/31/2023 Posts: 8092 Rating: (878)	Hello, Yes& that is why I would like to get confirmation about my selection. Please advice whether my following selection is right or wrong? So I select a motor near by this rating as follows. 1PH8352, 370 Kw, Mrated = 7361 Nm. with spees range N2 max = 800, N max 2800 RPM.Is this correct? Regards, DEEP.

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