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Output short break down with hot swapping function in 300 CPU

Created by: faming at: 11/4/2008 1:58 AM (9 Replies)

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11/4/2008 1:58 AM	Rate (0)
faming Advanced Member Joined: 6/8/2007 Last visit: 1/23/2025 Posts: 41 Rating: (1)	What is the key elements of possibility to use hot swapping function in ET200M(IM153 Series..)? I tried to use a 315-2DP CPU(also 315-PN/DP) and 153-2BA02-0XA0 to have a hot swapping function but when i swapped one of these modules between active bus, there was a short break down situation of all DO signal output no matter doing the pulled out or set the module back. This were not happening in my 400 CPU test. Whichtype of 300 CPUs could have hot swapping function ? s7 configuration test file attached.

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11/4/2008 3:36 AM	Rate (1)
dchartier Grandmaster-Expert Joined: 9/27/2006 Last visit: 1/26/2025 Posts: 12331 Rating: (2702)	Hello faming; Sorry, I don't have access to Step 7 at this moment, so I couldn't see the details of your configuration. So if this comment is not useful, please accept my apologies. Basically, to my knowledge, the "replace during operation" function is a slave property that you setup in the ET 200M parameters. Is this something you have taken into account? The following FAQ shows a screenshot of the required configuration, and discusses theactive bus modules required for the operation: http://support.automation.siemens.com/WW/view/en/29108474 Hope this helps, Daniel Chartier

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11/4/2008 3:14 PM	Rate (1)
J_Bell Posts: 5822 Rating: (412)	Dear all, well... I am a bit confused, because in my mind hot swapping was not released for the S7-300 PROFIBUS interface at all. The only point I know of that works at the S7-300 with hot swapping is PROFINET IO. If you check the ET200M manual you even see that there is a warning not to pull or plug output modules at all because this may lead to uncontrollable situations on site. About the S7-400 I know, as you mentioned already Daniel, that the S7-400 supports hot swapping by reconfiguring the single modules. I do not know if this helps... but this is the situation as I know it. If you want open a Service Request to get someone by the Customer Support to talk to you. Best regards J_Bell
J_Bell Posts: 5822 Rating: (412)
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11/5/2008 3:36 AM	Rate (0)
faming Advanced Member Joined: 6/8/2007 Last visit: 1/23/2025 Posts: 41 Rating: (1)	thank you for your answering .

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11/5/2008 5:06 PM	Rate (1)
H-H Platinum Member Joined: 7/2/2008 Last visit: 9/30/2024 Posts: 928 Rating: (309)	Hello all, As far as I knowthere's a trick you can do in S7-300 to enable hot swapping. Hot swapping basically depends on the existence of OB83 as J_Bell had said and this OB doesn't exist in most of S7-300 CPUs. To come over this, You can use the ET200M GSD file instead of dragging it from Profibus DP ET200M components in HW configuration. The point is that GSD file of ET200M will configure ET200M as a standard DP-slave. Then the OB which shall be called if ET200M has a problemisOB82 (Not OB83) which exists in all S7-300 CPUs. Now we come to the reason why there's a short break in output. I tried it before and had the same problem and couldn't get to a solution. I've read this trick in Siemens site before but I just can't find it now but as far as I remember, It was said that standard DP slaves (GSD configured) do not enable Acyclic communication. I have quite little knowledge about communication but I think the lack of Acyclic communication is the reason behind that short break in output. I hope to see a better explanation for this behaviour because it would be a great thing to have real and seamless hot swapping in S7-300. Best regards.

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11/5/2008 5:23 PM	Rate (0)
J_Bell Posts: 5822 Rating: (412)	Dear H-H, this might be true but only for DP-Slaves that work as DP-V0 Slaves, only DP-V0 provides only cyclic interfaces. Then it is slightly different. The latest DP Slaves only work as DP-V1 Slaves. Best regards J_Bell
J_Bell Posts: 5822 Rating: (412)
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11/5/2008 5:45 PM	Rate (0)
H-H Platinum Member Joined: 7/2/2008 Last visit: 9/30/2024 Posts: 928 Rating: (309)	Dear J_Bell, I've just foundthe FAQ I was pointing at. I did that test about 4 months ago and I really can't remember the part no. of the ET200M. But if I havethe latest IM153-2 and configured it with its GSD file, will it support Acyclic communication even though it is configured with GSD file? And if it works with Acyclic communication, Do you thinkhot swappingmight work without that short break in outputs?

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11/6/2008 2:23 AM	Rate (0)
faming Advanced Member Joined: 6/8/2007 Last visit: 1/23/2025 Posts: 41 Rating: (1)	dear all.. i did the test inlatestIM module 153-2BA02with GSD and none GSD parts in 300 test. It was still having output break down problem. But the option i only markedwith is"Startup if expected/actual config differ".I am not sure missing somthing option to mark or not ? I

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11/6/2008 12:24 PM	Rate (0)
J_Bell Posts: 5822 Rating: (412)	Dear H-H, well, the ability of the DP Slave to be able to run acyclic communication depends on the setting for the DP Version, if you have DP V1 in your GSD file set the Slave will also report diagnosis information by itself. If you use DPV0the Slave only supports cyclic communication.As far as I know the latest DP Slaves do not support DPV0 anymore. So it might be that the diagnostics request is being used as soon as you remove a module, but the OB 83 should not be used... I personally would not use this feature at all. Endangering your system is a risky game. Best regards J_Bell
J_Bell Posts: 5822 Rating: (412)
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11/7/2008 1:56 AM	Rate (0)
H-H Platinum Member Joined: 7/2/2008 Last visit: 9/30/2024 Posts: 928 Rating: (309)	Thank you J_Bell for your replies. I totally agree with you (Endangering your system is a risky game). When Itried this test, it wascompletely refused in my company (System Integrator). I haven't seen aplant or machine that can tolerate such observant quick break in output signals. But what makes me is that this trick is written on FAQ. In all cases, thank you very much and best regards.

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