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Urgent question about Siwarex U

Created by: Scope at: 11/7/2010 9:25 AM (9 Replies)

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11/7/2010 9:25 AM	Rate (0)
Scope Posts: 4 Rating: (0)	Hi, I have Siwtool V.2.1.9 I red the manual of Siwarex U and there are some things that i didn't understand. What is the actual meaning of the characteristic value and for example, what 2mv/v refers to ? What is the relation between the characteristic value of the load cell and the characteristic value entered in the siwatool ? in another word, what happened if the characteristic value of the load cell is 2mv/v and i choose the characteristic value in siwatool 4mv/v ? What is the usage of the adjustment digit 1 and adjustment digit 0 if I calibrate using actual weight ? What is the usage of the adjustment digit 1 and adjustment digit 0 if I use theoretical adjustment ? How can I spacify the resolution of the Siwatool ? Thanks in advance.
Scope Posts: 4 Rating: (0)	Last edited by: Scope at: 11/7/2010 10:29 AM Last edited by: Scope at: 11/7/2010 10:00 AM
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11/8/2010 2:28 PM	Rate (0)
Siwarexi Gold Expert Joined: 1/4/2007 Last visit: 12/2/2024 Posts: 1152 Rating: (175)	post deleted Siwarexi
	Last edited by: Siwarexi at: 11/8/2010 2:36 PM
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11/8/2010 2:35 PM	Rate (0)
Siwarexi Gold Expert Joined: 1/4/2007 Last visit: 12/2/2024 Posts: 1152 Rating: (175)	Hello Scope, To your questions: The characteristic value is one technical data of the load cell. You can see this parameter into the technical data sheet of the load cell. (See also the attached file as an example.) 2 mV/V means: If you are supplying the load cell with power, and the load cell is loaded with its nominal load, you can calculate the measurement signal of the load cell: (power supply) x (characteristic value) = (measurement signal of the load cell) For example: - load cell has a nominal load of 100 kg - load cell has a characteristic value of 2 mV/V - load cell is loaded with 100 kg - the Siwarex U module is used (power supply of the Siwarex U module = 6 VDC for the load cell) measurement signal of the load cell = (power supply) x (characteristic value) = 6 VDC x 2mV/V = 12 mV => The measurement signal of the load cell is 12 mV. You have to set the parameter “characteristic value” into Siwatool to the characteristic value of the load cell, because there exist load cells with different characteristic values (1, 2 or 4 mV/V). You can find a Quick Guide on the internet how to execute an adjustment with Siwatool U: http://support.automation.siemens.com/WW/view/en/37733600 Best regards Siwarexi Attachment characteristic value.JPG (435 Downloads)

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11/9/2010 10:14 AM	Rate (0)
Scope Posts: 4 Rating: (0)	Hello Siwaexi, Thank you for answering me. In the topic https://www.automation.siemens.com/tf/WW/en/Posts/48626#top ABenno Load cells can be normally loaded up to 150% of their nominal load, but the load cell input of the Siwarex U can only bear up to 110% of the nominal input signal. So if you have load cells with e.g. 2mV/V and set the Siwarex also to 2mV/V you can load the load cells up to 110% without any error. If you go above this you will get an error message. If you must load the load cells up to 150% you have to change the measuring range in the Siwarex U to 4mV/V and you can do this. Regards ABenno I don`t understand what does he mean with " measuring range " ? What will happen if the char. value of the load cell is 2mv/v and i set the char.value of siwatool to 4mv/v ? I red the Quick Quide.I understood some points ,please correct me if i was wrong. I realized that If i make adjustment using calibration weight, then I don't need to use adjustment digit 0 and 1. but, i didn't understand this paragraphs: For a 20 kg scale you may use a resolution of 1 g: Range 0 g to 20000 g For a 40 kg scale you may use only a resolution of 10 g Range 0.00 kg to 40.00 kg -->Choose resolution and comma before parameterization. How can i choose the resolution in siwatool? After a theoretical adjustment you can check the correct work of the scale by using a check weight. Whether the shown weight value is different from the check weight you can adjust both numbers by manual parameter input in the field “Adjustment digits 1”. Following DR3 must be forwarded to the SIWAREX U modul by double click “Send”. How can I adjust the parameters manually ?
Scope Posts: 4 Rating: (0)
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11/9/2010 12:16 PM	Rate (0)
Ammy Platinum Member Joined: 4/19/2008 Last visit: 11/21/2024 Posts: 1525 Rating: (159)	Scope Hello Siwaexi, Thank you for answering me. In the topic https://www.automation.siemens.com/tf/WW/en/Posts/48626#top ABenno Load cells can be normally loaded up to 150% of their nominal load, but the load cell input of the Siwarex U can only bear up to 110% of the nominal input signal. So if you have load cells with e.g. 2mV/V and set the Siwarex also to 2mV/V you can load the load cells up to 110% without any error. If you go above this you will get an error message. If you must load the load cells up to 150% you have to change the measuring range in the Siwarex U to 4mV/V and you can do this. Regards ABenno I don`t understand what does he mean with " measuring range " ? What will happen if the char. value of the load cell is 2mv/v and i set the char.value of siwatool to 4mv/v ? I red the Quick Quide.I understood some points ,please correct me if i was wrong. I realized that If i make adjustment using calibration weight, then I don't need to use adjustment digit 0 and 1. but, i didn't understand this paragraphs: For a 20 kg scale you may use a resolution of 1 g: Range 0 g to 20000 g For a 40 kg scale you may use only a resolution of 10 g Range 0.00 kg to 40.00 kg -->Choose resolution and comma before parameterization. How can i choose the resolution in siwatool? After a theoretical adjustment you can check the correct work of the scale by using a check weight. Whether the shown weight value is different from the check weight you can adjust both numbers by manual parameter input in the field “Adjustment digits 1”. Following DR3 must be forwarded to the SIWAREX U modul by double click “Send”. How can I adjust the parameters manually ? HI Scope, First You Download this Manual Basic Data Setting, 1. I don`t understand what does he mean with " measuring range " ? What will happen if the char. value of the load cell is 2mv/v and i set the char.value of siwatool to 4mv/v ? A. You have to see the Characteristics of the Load Cell, for the Liner & correct Responce of the Load Cell you have to put the Characteristics as per the Load Cell Name Plate. are you going to used your System over Weight ? then you have to think about the change the Characteristics. 2. I red the Quick Quide.I understood some points ,please correct me if i was wrong. I realized that If i make adjustment using calibration weight, then I don't need to use adjustment digit 0 and 1. but, i didn't understand this paragraphs: For a 20 kg scale you may use a resolution of 1 g: Range 0 g to 20000 g For a 40 kg scale you may use only a resolution of 10 g Range 0.00 kg to 40.00 kg A. This the Resolution of the Weighing as your Load Cell Weight Increase the Resolution is going to Decrease. the same thing is Explain in the Above Exp. 3.How can i choose the resolution in siwatool? After a theoretical adjustment you can check the correct work of the scale by using a check weight. Whether the shown weight value is different from the check weight you can adjust both numbers by manual parameter input in the field “Adjustment digits 1”. Following DR3 must be forwarded to the SIWAREX U modul by double click “Send”. the same thing Is Explain in the Above. Please Follow the Calibration/ Adjustment Procedure As per the Manual Link. if need then used for theoretical adjustment.
	Ammy New for every one.............. “No duty is more urgent than that of returning thanks.” If Problem Solved......! I can't help you privately - please post in the Forums
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11/10/2010 10:17 AM	Rate (0)
Siwarexi Gold Expert Joined: 1/4/2007 Last visit: 12/2/2024 Posts: 1152 Rating: (175)	Hello Scope, To your questions: 1. I don`t understand what does he mean with " measuring range " ? My answer: Abenno means with „measuring range“ the parameter “characterisitc value” into Siwatool. 2. What will happen if the char. value of the load cell is 2mv/v and i set the char.value of siwatool to 4mv/v ? My answer: Then you are using only half of the range of the AD converter of the Siwarex U module.This is no fault, but unusual. 3. but, i didn't understand this paragraphs: For a 20 kg scale you may use a resolution of 1 g: Range 0 g to 20000 g For a 40 kg scale you may use only a resolution of 10 g Range 0.00 kg to 40.00 kg My answer: The Siwarex U module is working internal only with Integer-values. An Integer-value has the highest value: 32,767. It is not allowed to overshoot this value for the values: - adjustment weight - current weight value of the Siwarex U module The decimal point is only for the Siwatool weight value display. Step7 is receiving an Integer-value! 4. How can i choose the resolution in siwatool? My answer: You can’t choose the resolution in siwatool. The change of the weight value is always “1” in the last figure. 5. How can I adjust the parameters manually ? My answer: … by setting the paramters into Siwatool manually. But why? Don’t you want to use the procedure as described into the Quick Guide? (Execute the commands “Adjustment zero valid” (if the scale is empty) and “Adjustment weight valid” (if the scale is loaded with the adjustment weight). That’s all!) Best regards Siwarexi

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11/10/2010 12:30 PM	Rate (0)
Scope Posts: 4 Rating: (0)	Hello Siwarexi , Thanks for you useful answers. Then you are using only half of the range of the AD converter of the Siwarex U module does half of range mean "65535/2" ? can you give an example ? The change of the weight value is always “1” in the last figure. I don`t understand. After a theoretical adjustment you can check the correct work of the scale by using a check weight. Whether the shown weight value is different from the check weight you can adjust both numbers by manual parameter input in the field “Adjustment digits 1”. Following DR3 must be forwarded to the SIWAREX U modul by double click “Send”. I asked here about how I can adjust the “Adjustment digits 1” in the theoretical adjustment. do I adjust using random numbers or there are a certain numbers. !! Best Regards Scope
Scope Posts: 4 Rating: (0)
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11/10/2010 3:31 PM	Rate (0)
Siwarexi Gold Expert Joined: 1/4/2007 Last visit: 12/2/2024 Posts: 1152 Rating: (175)	Hello Scope, 1. does half of range mean "65535/2" ? can you give an example ? My answer: If you are select into Siwatool “1 mV/V”, the AD converter expect a measurement signal of the load cell into the range of 0 … 6mV. If you are select into Siwatool “2 mV/V”, the AD converter expect a measurement signal of the load cell into the range of 0 … 12mV. If you are select into Siwatool “4 mV/V”, the AD converter expect a measurement signal of the load cell into the range of 0 … 24mV. Now, if you have a load cell with 2 mV/V and you set the parameter “characteristic value” into Siwatool to Siwatool “4 mV/V”, the following happens: The real load cell measurement signal is in the range of 0 … 12 mV (12mV, if the load cell is loaded with its nominal load, e.g. 100 kg). But the AD converter expect a load cell measurement signal into the range of 0 … 24 mV. (In this setting 0 mV means 2,427 digits and 24 mV means 65,535 digits.) That means 12 mV load cell measurement signal means approximately 30,000 digits and the AD converter is using only 50% of his range. 2. The change of the weight value is always “1” in the last figure. I don`t understand. My answer: The weight value is always changing up and down in the step of “1”, e.g.: 0 kg => 1 kg (load is increasing) => 2 kg (load is increasing) => 1 kg (load is decreasing) => 0 kg (load is decreasing) 3. asked here about how I can adjust the “Adjustment digits 1” in the theoretical adjustment. do I adjust using random numbers or there are a certain numbers. !! My answer: The “Adjustment digits 1” in the theoretical adjustment is adjust by pushing the buttons “Calculate adjustment digits” and “Accept calculation” But I haveone question to you: Do you want to do the adjustment: - with an adjustment weight or - with the theoretical adjustment? Best regards Siwarexi

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11/11/2010 8:55 AM	Rate (0)
Scope Posts: 4 Rating: (0)	Hello Siwarexi , Thank you very much . I will do the calibration using adjustment weight. but I want to know the both methods in case of needing to adjust using the theoretical adjustment. Best regards Scope
Scope Posts: 4 Rating: (0)
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11/11/2010 9:24 AM	Rate (0)
Siwarexi Gold Expert Joined: 1/4/2007 Last visit: 12/2/2024 Posts: 1152 Rating: (175)	Hello Scope, If you are doing a calibration with an adjustment weight, please note: The minimum adjustment weight is 5% of the sum of the nominal load of all load cells. For example: - 3 load cells - nominal load: 100 kg each load cell minimum adjustment weight = 5% x 3 x 100 kg = 15 kg Best regards Siwarexi

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