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Working with Recipes [S7-1200 (1214) & KTP 600 ]

Created by: Paras at: 12/1/2014 7:23 AM (11 Replies)

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12/1/2014 7:23 AM	Rate (0)
Paras Posts: 21 Rating: (0)	Hello! I'm having some problems in a recipe but its not the kind of recipes mentioned in TIA Portal and s71200 manuals, its a bit more complicated . I have 5 tasks and there are 3-4 parameters in each task, these tasks are performed in different order in every recipe and these tasks are repeated in each recipe about 3-4 times (with different parameter value) , i tried to do this with the help of DB but couldn't handle all that in one PLC prog. Also i need to code (ladder) in a manner that the operator can also make a recipe by picking up tasks in any order with different parameters through a HMI KTP600. How do i do it??? Kindly help me out in this Thanks and Best Regards,
Paras Posts: 21 Rating: (0)
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12/1/2014 1:38 PM	Rate (1)
eisenpferdreiter Posts: 1058 Rating: (93)	Paras Hello! I'm having some problems in a recipe but its not the kind of recipes mentioned in TIA Portal and s71200 manuals, its a bit more complicated . I have 5 tasks and there are 3-4 parameters in each task, these tasks are performed in different order in every recipe and these tasks are repeated in each recipe about 3-4 times (with different parameter value) , i tried to do this with the help of DB but couldn't handle all that in one PLC prog. Also i need to code (ladder) in a manner that the operator can also make a recipe by picking up tasks in any order with different parameters through a HMI KTP600. How do i do it??? Kindly help me out in this Thanks and Best Regards, Hello Paras, I would use one DB for each task, to store the parameters of the task. For the recipes I would use a sequence control, which I would write in GRAPH. Depending on recipe it should be possible to write one sequence control with different branches, so that every recipe could use the same sequence. The branches within the sequence control could be controlled by recipe variables that determine the task and the number of repeats. I hope this will give you a hint. regards
eisenpferdreiter Posts: 1058 Rating: (93)
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12/1/2014 4:52 PM	Rate (0)
William_B Posts: 5225 Rating: (1197)	eisenpferdreiter Hello Paras, I would use one DB for each task, to store the parameters of the task. For the recipes I would use a sequence control, which I would write in GRAPH. Depending on recipe it should be possible to write one sequence control with different branches, so that every recipe could use the same sequence. The branches within the sequence control could be controlled by recipe variables that determine the task and the number of repeats. I hope this will give you a hint. regards Dear eisenpferdreiter, Thank you for replying to Paras' question. I am very interested in your ideas for this puzzle, I hope to read more. Please notice that the S7-1200 PLC is being used for this solution, so not GRAPH. It would be interesting to see how the individual DBs are recalled. Please read again through the requirements.. * 5 possible tasks each can have 4 parameters * a task-recipe can be configured by the operator (a guess) * a task-recipe can combine and repeat of the 5 tasks in any order * each of the requested tasks can have its own parameter values * the KTP600 is used to configure the task-recipe (a guess) I have made an attempt in an earlier thread and would be happy to see other ideas. (no sarcasm intended) Regards. w LATE NOTE.. same type question by other user [LINK]
William_B Posts: 5225 Rating: (1197)	Last edited by: William B. at: 12/2/2014 5:41 AM some points are guess work not facts Last edited by: William B. at: 12/1/2014 4:59 PM add late note
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12/1/2014 4:56 PM	Rate (0)
William_B Posts: 5225 Rating: (1197)	Dear Paras, It will be most helpful to the guys if you could give information on.. * TIA version * CPU type and firmware version You will be a great sport if you could answer one or some questions.. * share your own ideas of methodology (this is not program code) * why do you need this? (professional vs academical) * when is the project due? Regards. w
William_B Posts: 5225 Rating: (1197)
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12/1/2014 6:41 PM	Rate (0)
Paras Posts: 21 Rating: (0)	Hello William ! * I'm using TIA Portal v11 with all 5 updates installed * CPU 1214 firmware version is 2.1 i guess * Well first i gave a thought to recipe then it seemed difficult because recipe in tia portal is not that varsatile, i thought to do it the simplest way by saving parameters and steps in one HMI runtime DB and then moving the DB to other PLC memory DB and then moving again to execution DB in PLC. * it is actually internship project given to me by my supervisor and he is too busy to help. * Project is due in a week, i'm very worried about it as i can't get a proper way out of it but i'll try to do it the sequencer way i'll let you know for sure if it works for me . thanks
Paras Posts: 21 Rating: (0)
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12/1/2014 7:40 PM	Rate (1)
0_Einstein Diamond Expert Joined: 7/7/2010 Last visit: 12/9/2024 Posts: 15479 Rating: (2455)	Paras Hello William ! * I'm using TIA Portal v11 with all 5 updates installed * CPU 1214 firmware version is 2.1 i guess * Well first i gave a thought to recipe then it seemed difficult because recipe in tia portal is not that varsatile, i thought to do it the simplest way by saving parameters and steps in one HMI runtime DB and then moving the DB to other PLC memory DB and then moving again to execution DB in PLC. * it is actually internship project given to me by my supervisor and he is too busy to help. * Project is due in a week, i'm very worried about it as i can't get a proper way out of it but i'll try to do it the sequencer way i'll let you know for sure if it works for me . thanks For the repeated tasks, I would suggest FBs, and for single tasks either FB or FC depending on the types of parameters you might need to send. Instead of recipe, you can have some simple sequencing setup to call or not call FBs or FCs or pass one of parameters for one recipe and another set for another recipe. Unless you are going into production or doing a proof of concept, the recipe methods are a bit of an overkill for a school project - unless you have time and desire to go that route. After doing one recipe project though, the next one would be so easy. It is your design to implement. Just be aware at the last minute, a wrinkle may be added that your program needs to be able to quickly handle. Watch out for coding "magic numbers". Use constants or set things up in watch table so you can basically run your program with very little changes. I remember a programming assignment that the day before it was to be live tested, a little wrinkle was added. The less experienced were scrambling to rework their program because they had not abstracted enough so everything was basically hard-coded. The wiring at the inputs was changed (in portal that is easy to "rewire"), and the timing of actions was changed globally for blinking lights and on and off times with only one exception. It made it easy for me as I had one change to one block of code and globally my blinkers were changed. Think like that and the week will go much easier.
	science guy
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12/1/2014 7:56 PM	Rate (0)
Paras Posts: 21 Rating: (0)	Hellohuggy_d1! Thanks for that, I'm working on that but i need a little hint or a demo program on sequencing. it'll be very helpful if you can provide me one. and this project will be implemented in a real machine and checked for bugs or any problems so i need to do it perfectly
Paras Posts: 21 Rating: (0)
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12/1/2014 8:04 PM	Rate (0)
Paras Posts: 21 Rating: (0)	I'm much stuck in the visualization of this project because KTP600 must provide a fiendly and easy environment for the opereator to enter the the recipe (sequence of different tasks with parameters in some order) for which i need some empty DBs or some sort of method to create DBs whenever the operator tries to make a new recipe. Thanks and best regards,
Paras Posts: 21 Rating: (0)
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12/1/2014 8:30 PM	Rate (0)
0_Einstein Diamond Expert Joined: 7/7/2010 Last visit: 12/9/2024 Posts: 15479 Rating: (2455)	Paras Hellohuggy_d1! Thanks for that, I'm working on that but i need a little hint or a demo program on sequencing. it'll be very helpful if you can provide me one. and this project will be implemented in a real machine and checked for bugs or any problems so i need to do it perfectly I have posted how I write sequencing many times in these forums using a very simple and "old-school" approach that is PLC brand neutral. I use two integer values to detect and set my current state. I compare the current state with a state within the sequence to activate a single step in the state machine per plc scan. After all the states have been checked and a potential next state is activated, I copy the new state to the state machine master. ----><----- --- pseudo code can be done in LAD/FBD or SCL if (state == 0) and (process_run) then next_state = 100 endif if (state = 100) then // handle initialization of system, delay as needed for system to stabilize ... next_state = 110 endif if (state = 110) then // handle step 2 of init .. next_state= 199 endif if (state = 199) then // clean up init stuff next state = 200 endif if (state = 200) then if (setup_complete) then next_state = 300 else next_state = 210 end_if end_if if (state = 210) then // perform system setup as required // scale or calibration types of activities // take input from hmi and scale as required // include as many states in 200 as needed .. next_state = 299 end_if if (state = 299) then setup_complete = true; next_state = 300 end_if if (state = 300) then // run process loop // set up for running // next_state = 310 end_if if (state = 310) then // step 1 of running ... next_state = 320 end_if ... same for 320-xxx as many tiny steps as you need ... if (state = 399) then // clean up from running // call shutdown routine ... next_state = 900 end_if if (state = 999) then // we are done running and ready to sit in manual mode // setup for manual mode ... next_state = 0 end_if /// this is the most critical step and needs to be the last state related statement state = next_state -----><---- Your HMI needs to activate functions that setup the system (100/200 sections of the above state machine), and trigger automatic running mode (300+), and also trigger stopping automatic mode. Supervisor of the block containing this state machine would handle e-stop and fault handling. This is strictly the process functions. You also need something that handles startup and fault recovery, but that is possibly outside the scope of your week unless it is your only task for the next week is this project. I think you see how this is PLC manufacturer neutral in that it uses no special instructions and it is dirt simple to create and copy/paste to create lots of states. In LADder, each network or rung is the "if" clause with a compare == instruction comparing current state to a hard-coded value. Keep 10 between your states so if something comes up, you can add up to 9 states between your existing states in a hurry.....
	science guy
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12/2/2014 12:29 PM	Rate (0)
Jens_app Gold Member Joined: 1/5/2011 Last visit: 11/29/2024 Posts: 815 Rating: (123)	Paras Hello! I'm having some problems in a recipe but its not the kind of recipes mentioned in TIA Portal and s71200 manuals, its a bit more complicated . I have 5 tasks and there are 3-4 parameters in each task, these tasks are performed in different order in every recipe and these tasks are repeated in each recipe about 3-4 times (with different parameter value) , i tried to do this with the help of DB but couldn't handle all that in one PLC prog. Also i need to code (ladder) in a manner that the operator can also make a recipe by picking up tasks in any order with different parameters through a HMI KTP600. How do i do it??? Kindly help me out in this Thanks and Best Regards, Dear Paras, if I understand correctly, you have 5 tasks which are executed on 4 different parameters for a definable amount of times? If so, you could do something like this (SCL code): [code] FUNCTION_BLOCK "FB_ExecuteSeletedTasks" { S7_Optimized_Access := 'FALSE' } VERSION : 0.1 VAR_INPUT "Start" : Bool; END_VAR VAR "Tasks" : array[0..4] of Struct // Structure that holdsthe TaskNumber and Amount of times that tag needsbe executed "TaskNumber" : Int := 0; "RepeatAmount" : Int := 2; END_STRUCT; "Parameters" : array[0..4] of Real := 10.0, 20.0, 30.0, 40.0, 50.0; // Array that holds your parameters "StartEdge" : Bool; END_VAR VAR_TEMP "index" : Int; "index2" : Int; END_VAR BEGIN #index := 0; //index which selects RepeatAmount of a task & index which selects TaskNumber #index2 := 0; //index which holds the number of repeats currently executed IF #Start = false THEN //Create a positive edge #StartEdge := false; // execute on edge END_IF; IF #Start = true AND #StartEdge = false THEN // execute program on start #StartEdge := true; // execute on edge FOR #index2 := 0 TO 4 DO //check all elements of the TaskNumber array IF #Tasks[#index].TaskNumber > -1 AND #Tasks[#index].TaskNumber < 5 THEN // only execute task if the value is between 0 to 4 (representing the 5 tasks) IF #Tasks[#index].RepeatAmount > 0 AND #Tasks[#index].RepeatAmount < 4 THEN // Range of amount of repeats = 1 to 4 FOR #index2 := 0 TO #Tasks[#index].RepeatAmount-1 DO // Repeat the task for the selected amount of times IF #Tasks[#index].TaskNumber = 0 THEN // EXECUTE TASK 1 "FC_AddParameters"(ValueToAdd:=10, Parameters:=#Parameters); END_IF; IF #Tasks[#index].TaskNumber = 1 THEN // EXECUTE TASK 2 "FC_DivParameters"(ValueToDiv:=5.0, Parameters:=#Parameters); END_IF; IF #Tasks[#index].TaskNumber = 2 THEN // EXECUTE TASK 3 "FC_MulParameters"(ValueToMul:=2.0, Parameters:=#Parameters); END_IF; IF #Tasks[#index].TaskNumber = 3 THEN // EXECUTE TASK 4 "FC_SubParameters"(ValueToSub:=20.0, Parameters:=#Parameters); END_IF; IF #Tasks[#index].TaskNumber = 4 THEN // EXECUTE TASK 5 "FC_Nothing"(); END_IF; END_FOR; END_IF; END_IF; #index := #index + 1; //Select next Task END_FOR; END_IF; END_FUNCTION_BLOCK [/code] You can select the sequence of the tasks by changing the elements in the TaskNumber array respectively. You can change the amount of times the task need to be executed by changing the RepeatAmount. It is just a draft program, quickly written and can contain bugs. Is this something you can use? Or am I not getting the intent? Kr, Jens
	Keep it simple and on-topic. A simple straight-to-the-point answer is often of more quality than a complicated one.
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