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how STARTER and TIA PORTAL work with one another

Created by: TTundra at: 5/22/2020 7:53 AM (7 Replies)

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5/22/2020 7:53 AM	Rate (0)
TTundra Posts: 4 Rating: (0)	ChristophD: I'm trying to learn how STARTER and TIA PORTAL work with one another. I have a system that uses both and I'm wanting to understand the programs, etc. Any suggestions on how to learn more would help. Siemens seems to have no tutorials on STARTER. I have both their Getting Started and their Commissioning Manual for SINAMICS S120 With STARTER, but something more like a textbook that shows how STARTER and PORTAL work together would help a lot! I'm not sure how or whether you might be able to help me or reach me, so I'm giving you my email if that is a better way to connect since you seem to know a lot about these systems: [snip]. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Split from Communication S120 CU212-2DP with S71500 (STARTER-TIA PORTAL).
TTundra Posts: 4 Rating: (0)	Last edited by: Jen_Moderator at: 05/22/2020 07:54:42 New subject after splitting. Removed E-Mail address.
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5/22/2020 8:19 AM	Rate (0)
ChristophD Grandmaster-Expert Joined: 5/12/2006 Last visit: 12/20/2024 Posts: 22482 Rating: (3039)	Hello, STARTER and TIA are complete independed SW Packages. they don't work with another, in no way. Regards Christoph

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5/22/2020 7:02 PM	Rate (0)
TTundra Posts: 4 Rating: (0)	My local Siemens dealer contracted for me to a company that physically assembled and built my control electronics for a servo motor and programmed it. They used both TIA Portal and STARTER to do so. TIA Portal was used to program the PLC and the HMI, whereas STARTER (as a subset of SCOUT) was used to program the Sinamic S120 drive. Both programs have to be loaded in order for the system to work. They, and someone at the Tennessee Siemens center, have told me that much, but not all of the functionality of STARTER has been built into V16 of TIA Portal. However, my system was programmed using a V13 TIA Portal program that does not have that capability. So somehow in my system both TIA Portal and STARTER are both needed and somehow inter-communicate using telegrams.
TTundra Posts: 4 Rating: (0)
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5/24/2020 3:42 PM	Rate (0)
ivo.k Advanced Member Joined: 1/11/2009 Last visit: 12/16/2024 Posts: 13 Rating: (2)	Hi, TTundra, you are talking about something else than ChristophD. Christoph is right - Starter and TIA are totally INDEPENDENT which means they work independently. But this DOES NOT mean that drives parametrized in Starter cannot talk to a PLC programmed in TIA! It is similar to using a robot together with a PLC - the robot is also not parametrized in the same SW as PLC but they can communicate together. Starter is SW for parametrizing / programming drives while TIA is SW for programming PLCs (and drives if you have an additional package called Sinamics Startdrive installed in TIA). Generally speaking, TIA - or more exactly Startdrive - tries to replace Starter. It is a matter of opinion what people prefer but as far as I know, not all the functionality of Starter for all drives has been transferred to Startdrive yet. The amount of transferred things increases with every new version of TIA portal. S120 in general has been supported since V14. That is why if you use TIA V13 and S120, then you MUST parametrize a drive in Starter. If I have more than a few drives, I also prefer using Starter for parametrizing them because it is faster and more efficient for me. Regards, Ivo

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5/24/2020 10:30 PM	Rate (0)
TTundra Posts: 4 Rating: (0)	OK, thanks, that helps a lot. Still, since I have to use both STARTER and TIA Portal, I need to figure out how they both work as a team to control my system. I am gradually learning something about each of them, but my original question still remains, namely is there some source that could help me learn how to understand the way they work together. I think somehow they intercommunicate, but I can't figure it all out without some kind of overview description that includes some details! Don't know if anyone out there has any suggestions for how I can learn more, but I'm hoping so.
TTundra Posts: 4 Rating: (0)
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5/25/2020 2:32 PM	Rate (0)
BKfacorp Experienced Member Joined: 10/26/2012 Last visit: 4/24/2024 Posts: 56 Rating: (2)	TTundra OK, thanks, that helps a lot. Still, since I have to use both STARTER and TIA Portal, I need to figure out how they both work as a team to control my system. I am gradually learning something about each of them, but my original question still remains, namely is there some source that could help me learn how to understand the way they work together. I think somehow they intercommunicate, but I can't figure it all out without some kind of overview description that includes some details! Don't know if anyone out there has any suggestions for how I can learn more, but I'm hoping so. The simplest answer I can provide is as follows: Use Starter to do all of your drive(s) setup (parameters,etc). Use TIA for your PLC setup (Blocks, HMI if you do use one,etc). The Telegrams configured in Starter/TIA will provide all the data exchange needed between Drives<->PLC. The 2 software packages are not Linked in any other way (software).

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5/26/2020 6:51 PM	Rate (0)
TTundra Posts: 4 Rating: (0)	Thanks for that quick overview. I'm beginning to understand. Let me check on a few things. 1) I assume that in a typical situation the PLC acts as the master and controls the behavior of the Drive, both telling it what to do via telegrams and getting return telegrams providing information to the PLC (and via that to the HMI) as to what is happening. 2) Further I assume that the cycle time of the program loops in the PLC determines how quickly the PLC can change its instructions to the Drive, and related to that it can't deal with any return telegrams from the Drive any faster than that program cycle time of the PLC. 3) In the case of closed loop servo motor control, I presume that the cycle time of the feedback between the encoders and the motor drive occurs on its own more rapid time cycle that is inherent to the Drive, encoders, and motor. Have I understood all that correctly?
TTundra Posts: 4 Rating: (0)
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6/2/2020 1:40 PM	Rate (0)
TechSupport SINAM... Bronze Member Joined: 2/7/2018 Last visit: 3/14/2023 Posts: 181 Rating: (30)	Hello, Yes, this is correct. If you are using both Starter and TIA, Starter will be used to set up your drives and TIA will be used to set up your PLC, HMI, bus connections and so on. The interface between the drives and the PLC will be done by inserting GSD / GSDML files into the hardware configuration in TIA. These GSD /GSDML files have to be configured with the respective telegramms which are also set up in the drives. Indeed the closed loop control will be happening in the drive internally with a faster cycle, while the actual values of speed and so on are returned to the PLC with the normal fieldbus cycle. Best regards, SINAMICS Technical Support

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